Should I just accept my lot? advice needed

A question about : Should I just accept my lot? advice needed

I don't know if anyone will read this and if you do sorry as it's gonna be a long one. I could really do with some advice.

I have been with DH for 13 years (married for 9) and we have 3 kids. Basically I am just not sure if we should stay together or what to do for the best. If anyone checks, yes I have posted similar questions in the past as basically our issues have been ongoing throughout the marriage and what usually happens is we argue and I say things must change for us to work. he says he will try which he does for about a week then it all trails off again.

The thing is I am changing now and I am not sure I can keep doing this forever.

I do love DH but I am not in love with him anymore and if anything it is more like a parent child relationship. We get on quite well and trundle along but there is no passion or any physical contact at all even kissing. (I am 34 he is 31). I admit I am an insecure person and I need that contact and in the beginning we had a great physical relationship but as I say over the years it has gotten worse. I gave him the space he was after and it has totally backfired, he never comes to me for affection and I get shrugged off if I try.
He also will not make any decisions and it drives me crazy hearing 'whatever' to just about every question I ask only for him to use my decisions against me if things go a bit wrong.

He is a good dad and has been supportive with my panic attack issues (not that he had much choice) but he is very hard on our 12 year old daughter. In fact at the moment he has not spoken to her for 3 weeks because she told the school that she thinks he hates her. To me his reaction is not acceptable even though I can understand him feeling hurt. I tried to talk to him about it but he just says its not anything to do with me. His parents are the same and they have disowned all of their children at some point (not forever though) when they disagree. I am worried though that if he will do this to DD what stops him doing it to the rest of us. As it is because of this he does not eat with the family anymore and the atmosphere is bad. I also disagree with the way he threatens to do things such as drive home without the kids if they don't hurry, do what he tells them etc. (normal parental threats but he actually means them and would probably do it and leave our 7 year old).

Over the years I have accepted him and for the sake of unified parenting I have not argued with him about the fact that he shouts at everyone and is too harsh on the kids but I am starting to think that actually I should be standing up for them and maybe I could do better on my own.

if I am totally honest I think we are still together mainly because I am terrified of being on my own. I am no good with diy type things although I have always been in control of the money so at least that's something. I have anxiety issues and don't go out that much and my friend has said she will support me if I leave him but I am still scared that something will happen to make me so anxious I cant look after the kids alone even though I know this is highly unlikely.

I am just fed up of worrying about what mood he will be in next.

Any advice is appreciated.

TIA

Best answers:

• Have you thought about marriage guidance through Relate? If he won't go with you, then you can go alone.
  Sounds like your OH hasn't really grown up if he threatens to leave the kids behind and in relation to not speaking to your DD.
  Is it worth sitting down with him (without getting angry) to find out how he sees his life with you and the kids going forward?
  As for divorce - you don't have to be good at diy, you can get someone in to do it for you.
• Parenting should be a joint effort, but each parent has a responsibility to protect the children and if the way that he treats them is unacceptably harsh, you absolutely need to stand up for them. If you don't, who will?
• He won't go to relate. He doesn't even want to talk about our problems. He just says he is sick of hearing the same old crap. I think he thinks I should just accept him as he is.
  As far as the kids are concerned it's just baffling. If anyone asks he always says it was me who wanted the kids not him but I know he does love them although his bond with our dd has never been as good as with the boys. My dilemma with them is if they are better with their parents together and just accepting him the way he is or will they be better with me looking after them as a single parent. I am sure lots of single parents do brilliant alone but I don't know if I will be good enough on my own. I just want the best for everyone.
• He sounds pretty controlling and self-centred.
  You cannot change him. He will only change if he decides that he wants to, and you cannot make him make that decision.
  What you can control is what you do, and the choices which you make.
  You have been together for 13 years, you've tried to change things and it hasn't worked. There is an old saw about the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Of course it is a cliche, but that doesn't mean it can;t also be true 9if a little harsh!)
  It's also worth thinking about the effect that all of this has on your children. Yes, a separation will be difficult for everyone, but as things are, the children are in a tense, unhappy atmosphere, and they are (particularly your daughter) also being bullied. They are also learning that this kind of behaviour is normal/acceptable in a relationship.Long-term, that could be very damaging.
  I would suggest that you consider seeing Relate. They will see you independently if your husband won't go, and you may find it helpful. You may also find it useful to try to identify if there are other networks you can start building so you have support if you do decide to separate from him - for instance, online fora related to your health issues, the forums at Wikivorce (which can be friendly and supportive as well as offering advice about the nets and bolts of any divorce) and family and friends.
  Consider sitting down and making a list of the positive and negative things about you relationship, and a separate one about the pros and cons of separating (see a solicitor for a free initial appointment so you have some idea of the financial consequences)
  Think about what would need to change for you to feel able to stay with him. It may be that you decide that it's too late , and that there isn't anything. Or it may be that you can identify specifics and if that';s the case, then you can speak to him and tell him how you feel. Be clear that you have been looking into divorce and that you are willing to give him the chance to rebuild the relationship but you need him to be committed to doing so.
  Don't give him an ultimatum unless you are willing to follow through f he is not prepared to change.
  When you are looking at the pros and cons, also think about how you could oeal with them. For instance - not being any good at DIY - could you start an emergency fund, putting a few pounds away each week so that if something needs doing, you can get someone round to do it? What about local colleges - do any of them offer evening classes in home maintenance? You Tube is good - there are loads of people who put up videos with step-by-step guides on how to do jobs. The 'in my home'; forum here is excellent for advice about identifying what needs to be done, how to do it, or what it might cost to get someone else to do it. You may find you have a friend who would be prepared to barter - what skills do you have? (For years,I got small jobs done around my house by a friend in return for me baking cakes for her. I once cooked a three course meal for her and 3 guests in return for getting my floor sanded.) As your daughter is 12, maybe you and she could learn together.
  It is always scary to go from the known to the unknown, but it's often less scary if you break it down into smaller bits. The idea of doing the mainentance on an entire house is daunting. Learning to change a washer because a tap is dripping *now* is much less scary.
  Whatever you decide, good luck. And if you decide to stay, do consider starting to stand up to him, if not for your own sake, for the children.
• You are only 34. If you are not in love with your husband, if the spark has gone, my advise is to leave, get out. You deserve more out of life and relationships. I stayed with my first husband well past our sell by date. I did not really understand what was missing until I met my present husband. As for DIY you can learn so many things from youtube or you can pay others to do it.
• Tbagpuss thanks for that. It has really helped clear things up for me I think. The last time this problem came to a head I asked him to leave if he didn't change. He said things would get better but then nothing changed at all. As for standing up for me and the kids I used to but at some point it became easier just to try and ignore it. I think I know what I should do I am just so scared.
  Thanks
• Thanks for the advice everyone. To be honest I think I have lost a lot of sense of what normal respectful relationships are. I know that I seem to have just let go a lot of things I would have challenged him on in the past simply because there is no point arguing. He never thinks he is in the wrong. He has never said sorry to me for anything. Guess I need to man up and do what's right for us. I have to be careful though because I know once I decide to tell him he will make things difficult for me. Do you think it would be wiser to tell him it's over when I know I will be moving out or tell him now?
  We are at the too of the housing list for the area I want to live so when a house comes up I should get it. I was thinking of waiting till then. It would still give him time to sort himself out. I just feel so deceiving but whilst we are still in this house I can't afford the rent on my own as it is more than the local housing allowance rate.
• I thought your story rang a bell.
  https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...=#post46874569
• Does he work? If the kids stayed with you, he would have to pay you maintenance.
• I'm sorry if this is not what you want to hear but you should be protecting your children from this emotional abuse.
  How can you say that your children will benefit from 2 sets of parents when the atmosphere is so dire?
  You know in your heart of hearts what you need to do. Yes it's tough but do you really want your children growing up with this learned behaviour?
• Eveie, the things you are saying in this thread are almost identical to the things you said in the old thread Sailor Sam posted.
  That was three years ago and it doesn't sound like anything has changed. It's pretty obvious you're not happy in this relationship. What are you hoping to hear in this new thread that wasn't said in the old one?
• Thanks for the honesty guys. I am normally a sane rational person but for some reason I haven't been able to let go. I am finally starting to change in myself so hopefully will have the strength to go through with this. Thanks again
• Hi, I'm not actually sure what he is bringing to this relationship, certainly not in a positive way anyway. I get the feeling that you are doing most things you would do on your own anyway but it's just that you are so used to things and that you feel you need the security of having somonelse around.
  I would definitely explore the counselling option. It will help clarify things in your own mind and to identify what resources you have available to you - support groups in your area, other mums at school/on the pta, your friends, the internet etc etc.
  I probably would not bother discussing it with your other half, just because it seems that it is unlikely to change anything (it hasn't worked so far so why would it make a difference now) and it might just cause more tension. I'd work on your confidence and your escape strategy.
  I'd also like to say your only 34. That's not really that old to start again, lot's of people are still single at that age. If you posted about your problems 3 years ago, what's changed? Do you want to still be in this position in 3 years time? What can you do differently? You can't change him but you can change your reaction to things.
  df
• Wozzie, I hope letting that out made you feel better.
• [QUOTE=Wozzie;66706671]What is she bringing? I feel like I've stumbled onto the private forum of the cast of Loose Women.
  What I'm reading seems to be vastly different from everyone else. I'm reading a woman who seems to need other people to make her life better emotionally flogging a man, who, after 13 years most likely has developed thicker skin and is no longer capable of pretending to care about the same old !!!!. Not only that she appears to be very underhanded as evidenced by her plotting to just drop a "Oh you know our new home that I used our status to secure? You're not going to be moving in there, expect a letter from the Child Support Agency!" bomb on the dude, and also seems to be pretty god damned shallow as evidenced by her considering DIY odd jobs a reason to keep him around.
  I have no intention of just dropping him in it and will not be seeking any money for the children I would certainly not try to make him pay for my decision. I mentioned the housing list as I know once I have found a house it will take a few weeks to sort things out anyway which will give him time. I would tell him now but after the things he has done in the past (such as making the children walk 2 miles to school in the rain because he wouldnt drive them in "your car" after a disagreement. I dont want to take his hurt/anger out on the children.
  What does she do for him? She clearly seems to need all this stuff from him so what does he need from her? If that answer is (as I suspect) nothing then by what criteria does she expect him to change?
  I have always tried to be supportive and I have changed alot over the years to try and get him to open up. I have also been supportive in his hobbies such as buying him his dream car (twice). I just wanted to make him happy
  Maybe I'm wrong but here's what I read:
  "yes I have posted similar questions in the past" - Yet didn't take any of your advice and did nothing to change my situation.
  I don't want to take this decision lightly and have never wanted to break up the family for my own selfish reasons
  "he says he will try which he does for about a week then it all trails off again." - Which shows he at least was willing to listen, respect your concerns and tried to change. Which thus far makes him better than you.
  He pays it lip service for the sake of getting me off his back I am sure. My biggest issue is that he will not talk to me about how he feels. When he does say I am doing somkething he doesn't like I try to take it on board. I know I am not perfect either
  "I do love DH but I am not in love with him anymore and if anything it is more like a parent child relationship." - Translation: I mother him and am then surprised when he attempts to remind me that he's his own man which leads to arguments over the best way to butter toast.
  I have never wanted to mother him and try to get him to make more of the decisions in the house but he doesnt want to
  "We get on quite well and trundle along but there is no passion or any physical contact at all even kissing etc" - Have you put on a !!!! load of weight? I actually lost 5 stone, it made no difference then I put it back on and neither did that. I asked him if it bothered him. I could cope if it did at least I would know but he says it doesnt When was the last time you gave him a casual blowjob? I used to offer all the time but he isn't interested at all he just pushes me away When was the last time you initiated sex? Are you initiating and he's refusing? If so why do you think that is? What might have changed about you to change the way he feels about you? This could be due to anything but you'll only tell us what you want us to know. The sexual contact dropped off early on, he says he just isnt bothered about sex, I have tried all I can to change this including just leaving him alone and not asking for three months. the result of that was I didnt get anything for 3 months
  Or he could be cheating, Or he could be gay or he could have developed an STD he's trying to keep under wraps or maybe he's scared that if you have sex he'll end up with another child. he knows that wont happen
  "He also will not make any decisions and it drives me crazy hearing 'whatever' to just about every question I ask" - Again no reference to what these questions are, or why you apparently have to make so many that it's an issue.
  anything, he wont even tell me what he would like for his tea, I have to choose for him. I ask what he would like from the shops and he says whatever then moans that we have no food. I ask for help choosing things for the house/kids and I usually get the same response
  I get the impression however that this is a case of you making the decision that you need to do something and then getting annoyed with him not wanting to engage with the decision you've already made. For example:
  You - "I think we'll have Chinese tonight."
  Him - "I wanted pizza."
  You - "No I don't want pizza, so where will we order this Chinese from?"
  Him - "Whatever..."
  You - "WHY DO I ALWAYS HAVE TO MAKE THE DECISIONS!"
  [COLOR="red"]see above, it usually goes
  Me - what shall we have for tea, have you any preferences
  Him - whatever
  Me - do you fancy chinese?
  Him - whatever
  Me - Pizza?
  Him - whatever/COLOR]
  I don't know if it's just been my own personal bad experiences but in relationships I often get the impression that the main thing the woman seems to do is think of !!!! that the man could be doing other than the thing he is actually doing which is the thing he wants to be doing. Like the rubbish, why is that always the man's responsibility?
  I must admit we do have our own "jobs" in the relationship. I get him to do manly things and he expects me to do everything else including the thinking. I don't have a problem with this but the way he decides what he will and will not do doesnt give me much choice. Our roles in the relationship were set by him not me yet he still complains
  " has been supportive with my panic attack issues (not that he had much choice)" - Love that casual dismissal.
  [COLOR="red"]he doesnt have sympathy for people with mental health issues he just gets annoyed that I have these panic attacks/COLOR]
  "but he is very hard on our 12 year old daughter. In fact at the moment he has not spoken to her for 3 weeks because she told the school that she thinks he hates her." - There is clearly way more to this story. Why is your daughter just randomly telling teachers that? In what capacity does that come up? Why does she think he doesn't like her?
  she was having problems at school and self harming. she told the teacher as they noticed her being down. she said one of the reasons was because her dad shouted at her and hates her. I tried to talk to him calmly about this but he thinks swearing and shouting at her is ok and he feels mad that she talked to school about how she feels and what he said. she is no angel but he is overly harsh on her all the time. he wont talk about it though he just thinks he is in the right even though i explained that she hasnt changed because of his shouting
  "I also disagree with the way he threatens to do things" - Which is pretty much the only thing the modern parent has in their arsenal. Why is he put in this position? It sounds to me like he's the one who has been pushed into the role of being the rod to provide discipline whilst you're acting as a lobbyist for your children. That's not the way it should work, if he's the one constantly doing the punishing and telling off which leads to a rift between him and his daughter...
  I discipline my children I just dont feel that screaming and swearing at them or telling a seven year old you will leave him on his own is the right way to go. Like I said he has actually done this sort of thing before (not leaving the kids on their own) so I know he would do it.
  "Over the years I have accepted him" - No, clearly you haven't.
  your probably right I just accepted the situation I was in and that he would never change
  "for the sake of unified parenting I have not argued with him about the fact that he shouts at everyone and is too harsh on the kids" - Translation: I've been content to sit back, get hugs and play games whilst relying on him to be a towering authority figure so they'll actually do what I tell them.
  I used to challenge him early in the relationship. that resulted in a smashed up tv and dints in the car because he was mad. he has never been violent but does push his weight around literally if I want something he does not want me to have and this has been quite scary at times
  "but I am starting to think that actually I should be standing up for them and maybe I could do better on my own." - Translation: I've started to think that maybe the role he was forced to take isn't even necessary, and that without the person I rely on for discipline they won't actually need any.
  I know the kids need discipline and I am the first to admit that through him a have learned how to be not such a soft touch (and yes I have told him this)
  Which may or may not be true, it's all good whilst they're young. When they start breaking into their teens, mixing with other kids and fall in with bad crowds and stuff you might find you miss not having an authority figure around and be surprised at the things you're driven to do.
  I am perfectly capable of disciplining my own children, I don't rely on him for it at all. having an autistic child meant I had to
  If you want to change his outlook regarding his daughter just tell him that when kids rebel they rebel against the wishes of authority, and the parents of strippers have two main clich! stereotypes.
  1) Absent fathers
  2) Overbearing fathers
  A subtle reminder of that fact should be enough to give him pause.
  I have talked to him or at least tried to about this as I have seen what you are saying happen myself but he agrees one minute then disagrees the next
  "I am just fed up of worrying about what mood he will be in next." - Then stop worrying about it, just chill the !!!! out and stop analysing everything and he'll probably follow suit.
  I try not to but when he is in a bad mood he takes it out on all of us
  " I think he thinks I should just accept him as he is." - See why earlier I said you hadn't accepted him for who he is?
  Also why wouldn't he expect you to accept him as he is? If you applied that to me I worked very hard and experienced a lot of !!!! to be who I am and I like who I am. If you don't, then !!!! you.
  thats his view exactly, most of the time but he has made comments over time such as "we both know this went bad long ago" which make me think he may feel differently
  Most men are pretty secure in who they are as a person, we'd all like an extra couple of inches but other than that we generally wouldn't change much. Often what men want from a relationship is freedom, if you've got a girl who you like and she loves you and you're really into each other but are respectful of each others time and space, for a man that's the best !!!! in the world. The problem is women are always looking to improve !!!!, they're always looking to push things and this at some point will impact everything the man loved about the initial relationship namely his space and his time.
  I give him his space and he is free to come and go as he pleases. I encourage him to do his own thing
  At the end of the day do what you want to do, but have the integrity to own that decision. If the kids get upset at you that you're splitting up the family say what you have to say to make them feel better but don't try to put the !!!! onto him and don't expect him to be cool with your decision I am not that insensitive, even if I diagree with him I still try and get the kids to see his side even if he has been a bit harsh. Also don't be a complete scumbag about it, don't string him along let him know what you're thinking of doing before you do it.