chi running

A question about : chi running

i started running not that long ago after a fellow mse'r announced her new years resolutions and i stupidly asked how i could help, her reply was to help her with three of her challenges, so ... i took up running with the intention of later on in the year running a half marathon.

i love running, i have really enjoyed it so much, how ever, just as i was getting into it i got shin splints, i have been using compression socks to help, but alot of the websites say it is due to heel strike ( guilty) and over use of the lower leg ( guilty) ... it also is very much due to being overweight ( very very guilty of this one)

no i am working on the weight and really want to bring it down, but i am also trying to work on a mid foot strike and basically follw the chi running technique as it apparently cuts down on shin splints and other injuries

i'm struggling with it tbh, i cant seem to understand it at all, i try to put my body at a slight forward angle, but that i think i over lean and cant seem to correct it, i am also still heel striking ... or even front foot striking due to leaning forward, i am also over reaching with my stride which is apprently not a good idea either

does anyone have any advice on how i can correct these faults as i really want to get back to the running that i am missing

Best answers:

• Never heard of chi running.
  I use new balance minimus trainers for running as it is close to bare foot running. Very little support. I find I now naturally land on the ball of my foot rather than the heel as I am not wearing trainers with big soles.
  Read a book called "born to run" which was about how long distance runners ran bare foot or with very little support.
  Goes against what we are taught, about having these supportive trainers.
• I have a pair of vibram five fingers, they are meant to help with that might give it a try
  How do you find it ?
• It sounds to me like you need a good pair of shoes, which provide a balance of support (sometimes called motion control) and cushioning.
  Stay away from ultra lightweight shoes, they are for very light, experienced runners, and the soles are sliplasted, so that all the road shock is transferred to your lower legs. In my youth, I bought a pair of Adidas Rob DeCastella Adiracer, and gave myself shin splints, because of the lack of cushioning (they were then consigned to being used for badminton on carpet courts).
  I found that the best compromise shoes were Nike Air Pegasus, but New Balance also make some really great support shoes.
  You could probably do with going to a specialist running shop, and tell them what is happening, they will be able to look at your foot position and stride pattern, check for pronation (and supination) and sort out if you are a heel or forefoot striker.
  Good luck!
• Another vote for a gait check at a running shop here! They'll sort you out with the right shoes for you and be able to advise you on running technique.
  I don't run much being more into weights, but when I did couch to 5k I was fitted for some and my running really improved.
  Can I ask where you got the Vibrams from? I want some for weight training
  HBS x
• I've been to a running shop and was fitted with a shoe after them checking my style ... I explained tat I would be running on a treadmill and they took this into account when they checked me ... I'm wondering if I have been duped
• If you have been fitted for shoes, they might have taken into account that you said you were treadmill running. Are you now running outdoors?
  What I think has probably happened is that your cardio fitness is stronger than the adaptations your body has made to running. I reckon that you have just been very enthusiastic and have just gone out too far too fast too soon especially on concrete pavement. Common mistake amongst beginners and also those who have not run for a while who think they can start where they left off.
  Don't try to change how you run without expert advice - go back to the running shop and ask how to run in a more 'barefoot' style. The shoes you will have been given should take into account how you run and should encourage you to run in the most efficient manner. It is not ideal to have a very heavy heelstrike i.e. the back edge of your heel lands down heavily then you 'splat' your foot down, but neither is it good to run on your toes.
  I say run the way that is most comfortable as that is your natural gait and how the shoe shop assessed you so your shoes should compensate. Yeah, barefoot, chi, natural running is supposed to be naturally how we run, but sitting at a desk all day and having lifestyles far different to our ancestors means that not everyone can do so safely.
  A half-marathon later in the year should be do-able, but be careful about which programme you use. A lot of them online are aimed at people who are have been running 3/4 times a week consistently for about 6 months.
  For now stop running till the shins are healed. Ice them regularly. Some people find rolling a rolling pin up and down them helps.
  When you feel better, drop down mileage and speed - start back slowly ideally on softer ground like a mud track or something. Try to strengthen your shins and stretch your calves out. Google for some simple exercises - one thing to do is to try to scrunch paper up with your toes. Alternate walking around on your heels then your toes.
  Be aware that this is a chronic condition and will likely recur so take your time adding on time and mileage and get rest days/cross-training days in as well.
• thanks Gleek, that's fantastic advice, i have only been running on the treadmill so far ( although i did park run twice but only ran 100 mtrs or so and walked the rest)
  i think you could be right about my body not being ready, i have never really ran before, tbh i didnt enjoy it at all, and couldnt get the proper equipment anywhere ( big busted, they have only made my size of underwear in the last few years)
  i know that the weight i am carrying is most deff not a help and i have been losing weight as well, but i need to excercise as well as look at the food consumption, i do excercise but it's mainly weight training ( to build muscle thus burn fat) but i have caught the running bug and really do enjoy it, so i want to keep it up as much as i possibly can.
  i do have a very sedentary job, although it isnt at a desk, it is basically emergency medical intervention, i work night shift and basically watch t.v for 8 hours or so on a couch ( i work 10 hour shifts), trying to ensure i am quiet and dont wake people, i do do a bit of paper work, physical work but very very little ( far too little for my liking)
  i have been looking for other jobs, but given the current climate, they are nigh on impossible to get.
  i have only so far managed up to week two of the C25K programme so i really am at the very basics of running, i have taken another week off but i will start back this week at the begining of the programme, you only run for 8x1 minute intervals so that should be doable
  thanks everyone for the advice, will let you know how i go with it all
• If you enjoy running, there is no reason why weight should make a difference to whether or not you should do it. Just go slowly. I read somewhere that a force of around 3x your weight does through you when running - that is why shoes fitted to you are really important and it is important to build up slowly
  Good job for starting with Park Run - keep it up and just add a bit more running each time! If you want to do a half marathon, you are also best to do some running outdoors - it is much easier on the treadmill as it does absorb some impact. You don't want to have done all your running indoors then go out and race a 10K or a half marathon on pavement. That will make you feel really tired and will risk injury because you have not built yourself up to the distance on such a hard surface.
  That was really my point about the whole body not being ready for it. Sounds like your joints/bones aren't used to the impact yet and when you push it then you get hurt. There is nothing wrong with repeating each week a couple of times - taking it really slowly.
  This is the foundation for a lifetime of running - don't burn yourself out!
• Actually just thought - I have never done it, but pool jogging with a floatation belt in the deep end of the pool is very good rehab for injuries and good for cross training. Again, remember that it does not equal a session in terms of getting used to the impact, but it would be good for exercising whilst injured
• thanks gleek, i was hoping to stick to the treamill just now till the weight came down a bit as i was aware of the impact, i havnt been back to park run for a while as i was wanting to get a bit better first also.
  i was thinking doing the c25k week one for two/three weeks before moving onto week two then do that for two to three weeks etc which should help me get used to the impact and help me loose the weight more.
  once i succeeded in completing the c25k i was thinking of starting the c210k on the treadmill and also starting outdoor running in park run so that i am getting used to running outside,
  does that sound safe enough?
  even if i dont get to do a half marathon this year i will do it next year ( although i would like to do one this year) i do however want to do it safely, and i want to be able to eventually build up to a marathon or more, but that will only happen if i continue to enjoy it and manage to do so safely and injury free... that is my main aim
• so i possibly start with my vibram 5 fingers just now as that is more barefoot running style, or should i stick with my current trainers ?
• Have you been on a course?
  I'm also pretty large and it was eye-opening. They video you so you can see your form. I've changed how I walk since and I'm a lot less injured. It's worth the money and cheaper than changing your shoes.
  My course was with Nick Constantine.
  If you can't go on a course, get someone to video you and see how you are conforming to the book.
  Also check out Vivo Barefoot's website and Barefoot Beginner on FB. Your feet take ages to adapt to minimalist footwear so it's best to learn as much as possible and take it very easy.
  Runner's World forum is also good.
• thanks yonk for the info, i would love to go on a course, but when i looked there were none near me at all
  never thought of filming will ask hubby if he can do it for me
  i decided to start back with the c25k running tonight my shin splints seemed to hold up and i will deff be wearing the compression socks from now on as i think they help, it wasnt easy peasy but i did feel i could go on and on but i chose to stop where i was as i dont want a repeat injury, will build it up slowly
  i tried to concentrate on my midfoot strike tonight as apparently that is meant to be the way to run, i actually didnt find this too hard, although tbh i possibly didnt get it right it just felt right ( maybe a good reason for the video) i also tried to work on my stride taking smaller steps etc so that i dont over stride, i found this bit easy but i think that is due to me being 5ft1 inch and having a small stride anyway more than me actively working at it lol
• So I think that the pace of your plan sounds like a really good idea, but just remember to listen to your body.
  In terms of running outdoors - I would start ASAP for a few reasons:
  1. WHen you start the c210K you are not starting from couch - you will be at 5K. Therefore, your fitness will be more at a higher level than your bones/muscles which may result in splints unless you significantly decrease your mileage for a bit. I would start going out once a week on pavement just now to build up slowly.
  2. It is also more difficult outside - weather, uneven terrain, hills etc. It will be mentally less demoralising to build your skill up with this in mind than to suddenly find it much more difficult than it used to be when you start going out on the 10K plan.
  3. I think that part of the fun of doing a plan is to enter a race. It would be a good idea to enter a few races before a half marathon, so you will want to be building up to doing more runs outside before entering a race for life or something.
  In terms of the shoes - I would stick with the ones that were fitted. BF running is a technique that is worth learning at a class and, as a poster earlier said, is really more suited for lighter more biomechanically efficent runners. If you want to go BF then get yourself fitted for a good BF shoe - there are different levels of support and cushioning - Brooks do a good range but it will depend on your foot type. As the poster above said, it takes a long time to build up, so if you are looking to run to get fit then it is probably unlikely you will get very far just starting out BF.
  I would build up to be running for an hour comfortably for a long run with an additional 2 runs a week in normal shoes and then, with guidance from a running shop, slowly incorporate some minutes in each session with BF shoes - building up again as if you were a beginner. Please don't take advice from forums on this matter - especially if you are an injury prone, heavier beginner - that is a sure fire way to get hurt. BF runners are often quite evangelical about their technique - it is great - but please take the advice of someone who has seen you run and who knows what they are talking about. I would hesitate to follow a book - it is really difficult for the untrained eye to know waht to look for. After over 7 years, I still find it hard to see the intricacies of my gait analysis!!!
  Sorry for rambling on, I hope this helped a little. Keep it up - you are doing great! Why don't you stay involved with Parkrun by volunteering some weeks - you never know, you might feel up to entering sooner than you think - and there is nothing wrong with walk/running at all!
  HTH
• Just to wish you good luck - I have tried running several times and each time I end up with shin splints! I've got motion control trainers, I've lost three stone, and it's still no better
  Just had a look at the Chi Running site, there are no instructors near me but I'll certainly be researching it more. Let us know how you get on!
• its a great help gleek, please feel free to give me more advice as you see fit.
  i think i might keep this thread going for a wee while to chart my attempts incase it helps anyone or anyone has some friendly advice to share
  my plan then ( and please feel free to correct me if i am wrong )
  continue with the c25k, try and incorporate once a week a short road run ( even 500 metres over 5x100 m would be a good start) so that i can build up my stammina for outside, which inturn will help me prepare for a half marathon etc...
  once i can run comfortably outside for an hour or so and have lost a good amount of weight i will start with BF running, taking it very easy, possibly even going back to c25k to start over again so that i will be as injury free as possible
  how does that sound?
  cockaleekie, do you fancy trying with me? i have had these shin splints now so i am at risk of having them again, so i will be taking it easy, wouldnt mind a bit of company on the journey if your up for it?
• Sounds like a plan. Def do one session all outside first then incorporate moreoutside sessions a week. I bet you will enjoy it more than t Mill. Use map my run now or gmap pedometer to track your routes. If on tmill set the incline to 1% running on the flat is like running downhill because the belt helps you. The incline mimics outdoor flit terrain better.
  When you go onto 10k prog keep your mileage up but add in time at the end to go bf. I'm not an expert on this but I am trying to move to a shoe with a lower profile because even traditional ones are changing to a bit less raise in the heel which kills me as I tend to run too much on my toes and lower heels mean even tighter calves. ... anyway weensy I am saying is that I end my regular run at my house say five minds early then I change into other shoes and go out for five mins. Build the time up slowly across all sessions.
  I would say that 5 fingers may not be the best ones though. I'd get refitted again. oyyou might find that as you lose weight and get fitter your gait may change.
  Running alone prob won't make you lose tons of weight esp not at start. I only lose weight through running alone doing ten miles plus long runs, with speed sessions and a coupke of 6 mile runs during week. Though i am quite closer to ideal weight so it is harder to lose the last bit . What will help for sure is doing some body weight exercises. You can do this on shift. Planking, burpees,, pressups ,tricep dips, russian twists, leg raises , arm circles, superman. Twenty mins on non running days will make a huge difeeence.
  Many runners including me are guilt y of overestimating cals burned in running because you get so hungry after. A mile Burns about 100 cals deepening on your weight and speed. But it's not all about weight tho. ... its about the wonderful endorphins or as I heard someone call them once, the inner dolphins!
  Anyway, disgressing. Plan sounds good. Keep us posted. Good luck!
  Ps sorry for typos. On phone and can't work it properly!
• thanks again gleek, please feel to digress away i am grateful for any input and help you can offer
  i have to admit i am not really running for the weight loss just hoping that is a nice side effect more than anything else, i'm running initially to help the fellow mser but i think also now that i am enjoying it i am running for the pleasure.
  today i walked up the top of the hill, then started to run to the shops, as soon as i started running i remembered i didnt have my compression socks on, i remembered this due to the pain in my shins starting again, i also forgot to put on my sports bra so was a bit bouncy, although to be honest it was the pain in my shins that made me stop i stopped after about 100 mtres as it was getting too much, i will try it again later on in the week and remember the compression socks
  will now rest my leg again so that i can do the c25k tomorrow on the treadmill, as i dont want to hurt my shins and once again have to stop, will do maybe a bit of weights later on though as i think that will help also
• If you have had shin pain today you really should be resting until this is healed and sadly this can be weeks or months, you are unlikely to 'get used to it' by running on an injury. Definitely don't do any pavement or road running, it's very tough on the body and completely unnatural to run on such a hard surface. Grass and sand are softer. Also be very cautious with hills - up or down.
  Are you warming up thoroughly, ten full minutes of low impact (walking or elliptical trainer) before you do any jogging at all? And what sort of flexibility work are you doing, have you had a full body movement or posture assessment at the gym? You won't be able to change your running style to a balanced one if you have knots/ trigger points/ muscle imbalances.
  Where are the shin splits, front or inside or both? Have you ever been taught self myofascial release (foam rolling)? This is quite time consuming and uncomfortable/ painful but could be the ideal thing to do when working shifts. Have you been doing deep core or balance work, or mainly superficial abdominals (crunches)?
  It wouldn't do any harm to go to another running shop and check you have been sold the right shoes - although I don't think that is the most likely cause. It did happen to me when I was new to running, long before I was qualified, I was sold motion control for only a moderate overpronation.
  If you do film anything also film a series of overhead squats from all four sides. No shoes, no weights, limited amount of clothing or tight stuff so you can see your hips, knees, spine and feet clearly. I have clients in fitted t-shirts or vest tops, not too baggy shorts or gym trousers with the legs rolled up.